In need of fast(er) programmer for new PIC33CK devices

[John Lawton]

Hilarious, the Microchip SNAP programmer/debugger "...features a powerful 32-bit 300 MHz SAM E70 Arm® Cortex®-M7 based MCU for quicker debug iterations".

https://www.mouser.co.uk/pdfDocs/50002771B.pdf

How are the mighty fallen.

[diebobo]

Just a closure message, i've received the Northern Software programmer and it is FAST !.. Had some trouble setting it up but it now works with the commandline and Positron Studio. The test program ( blinky ) took like 20 secs orso on the Pickit 3, and now like 0.5 sec. So thanks a lot for that piece of info, very happy at the moment

[charliecoutas]

diebobo

Does it need the cumbersome MPLAB software or is the software interface small and simple?

Charlie

[diebobo]

It is completely standalone, so no need for MLAB software.. I doubt it can even work with MPLAB if u wished, but i only got it working for a few hours so total noob at this point with this programmer.

Check this link for impression of the GUI : https://www.northernsoftware.com/nsdsp/soft/prog/    I think it looks completely simple and clean.. And then there are a bunch of command line utils.

[charliecoutas]

Very useful, many thanks.

[John Lawton]

Just a closure message, i've received the Northern Software programmer and it is FAST !.. Had some trouble setting it up but it now works with the commandline and Positron Studio. The test program ( blinky ) took like 20 secs orso on the Pickit 3, and now like 0.5 sec. So thanks a lot for that piece of info, very happy at the moment

For many years I've used the meLabs U2 programmer, but if it won't support the latest devices I may have to change. I don't think you mentioned which Northern Software model you're using.
https://www.northernsoftware.com/nsdsp/cmp/hh.htm
Is it the NSDSP-2-X - which is the one I'd use as it supports HV programming?


John

[diebobo]

I don't think you mentioned which Northern Software model you're using.
https://www.northernsoftware.com/nsdsp/cmp/hh.htm
Is it the NSDSP-2-X - which is the one I'd use as it supports HV programming?

I did not mention it indeed.. I got the NSDSP-1-UX cause i do not see myself need the HV part of it. However i do see myself make mistakes with selecting the V settings and blow thing up ...  Nah, for some old projects i just use the Pickit2 if they don't support the LV programming.

[Bravo]

I use the ME Labs USB  programmer from melabs.com
It is very fast.

[John Lawton]

I've used a U2 for many years with PIC14/16/18 series parts but as it didn't work with the dsPIC33CK parts I bought the Northern Software model.

John

[trastikata]

I recently purchased PG164100 from Microchip Direct:

https://www.microchipdirect.com/dev-tools/PG164100

inexpensive (10$) and very fast programmer if you don't need the standalone programming function. Works surprisingly well with MPLAB X \.

[John Lawton]

That's interesting, but MPLAB X .... in contrast the Northern Software application in very fast to load...



John

[CPR]

For no reason at all, this kind of reminds me of David Jones (EEV Blog) review of the then new Pickit3. Followed with Microchips response. Classic stuff!

EEVBlog review - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjfIS65mwn8
Microchip response - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YUvlrVlNao

[trastikata]

That's interesting, but MPLAB X .... in contrast the Northern Software application in very fast to load...

Hello John,

I was surprised too but after I have been working with that programmer and 512k devices I can say it is really fast with MPLAB X.

[RGV250]

Hi John,
Did you buy from them directly, just wondering about the postage cost and customs charges etc.
The pre programmed chip versions look interesting, for less than £4 you can make you own or build it into the board.

Regards,
Bob

[John Lawton]

Hi Bob,

I don't remember what I paid, sorry. I paid what the website charged me, no import taxes/duties on top IIRC.

Yes, the programmed chip versions could come in useful.

John

[Gamboa]

Hi,

I've attached a comparison table of features for different Microchip programmer models in case it helps you make a purchase decision.

Regards,
Gamboa

[LeonJ]

I've recently built and tested a Northern Software NSDSP programmer, using their 3.3 V programmer chip on a simple stripboard assembly. The results have been rather impressive!

I did a direct comparison against a PICkit 4 using Microchip IPE, programming the same dsPIC33CK256MP505 target board with exactly the same 27 KB HEX file.

Code Select Expand

**Programming performance comparison**

| Operation | PICkit 4 + IPE | NSDSP |
|-----------|----------------|-------|
| Program   | 10.0 s         | 1.28 s| (The NSDSP actually programs and verifies in this time)
| Read      | 16.2 s         | 4.64 s|
| Verify    | 4.13 s         | 0.94 s|

I've also incorporated a CH340N (8-pin) USB-to-UART bridge onto the board. Its TX and RX connections are coupled to the target processor's ICSP clock and data lines through 1 kΩ resistors. This allows those same two microcontroller pins to be used for serial communication with a PC terminal once programming and verification have been completed.

The NSDSP programmer chip itself also provides a UART bridge facility. However, I elected to use the CH340N instead, giving me a standard Windows virtual COM port and the freedom to use whichever PC terminal application I prefer.

The result is a compact combined programming and serial communication arrangement, without having to change connections on the target board.

One further feature I've implemented, with the help of AI, is a small PowerShell watchdog script that monitors the output HEX file generated by the Positron compiler. Whenever it detects that the HEX file has been updated following a compilation, it automatically uploads and programs the target device.

This makes the entire edit–compile–reprogram cycle hands-free. I simply compile in Positron, and by the time compilation is complete, the target is automatically reprogrammed and ready for testing.

I'm very pleased with the performance and functionality of this little setup!

[diebobo]

I've recently built and tested a Northern Software NSDSP programmer, using their 3.3 V programmer chip on a simple stripboard assembly. The results have been rather impressive!

I did a direct comparison against a PICkit 4 using Microchip IPE, programming the same dsPIC33CK256MP505 target board with exactly the same 27 KB HEX file.

Code Select Expand

**Programming performance comparison**

| Operation | PICkit 4 + IPE | NSDSP |
|-----------|----------------|-------|
| Program   | 10.0 s         | 1.28 s| (The NSDSP actually programs and verifies in this time)
| Read      | 16.2 s         | 4.64 s|
| Verify    | 4.13 s         | 0.94 s|


I will quote myself from earlier in this post : "Just a closure message, i've received the Northern Software programmer and it is FAST !.. Had some trouble setting it up but it now works with the commandline and Positron Studio. The test program ( blinky ) took like 20 secs orso on the Pickit 3, and now like 0.5 sec. So thanks a lot for that piece of info, very happy at the moment "

Nice to hear u happy with it, so am i ! To a level i cannot program without anymore, waiting 30 secs or longer for a programming action when you are in the flow of trying stuff out is just sooooo slow and irritating...